This blog is quite simply my place to share my ruminations. Specifically, my thoughts about God (also known as theology), what the Bible teaches (also known as doctrine), religion (ok, I'll stop explaining now), the afterlife...(and I think you get the big picture here.)

I am admittedly an amateur in many ways. Though I can be very opinionated, I really don't know everything and I am very sure that I will have errors in thinking, gaps in my knowledge, and possibly times when I'm too proud or stubborn to see it.

Still, while I welcome comments, I'd like em to be respectful of myself and others (including God, yes!) even if you find my ideas distasteful or ignorant. After all, if you wish to expound on that sort of thing, you can always start your own blog. No one is stopping you and it's totally free. :)

Monday, April 9, 2012

A few odds and ends on yoga and meditation

OK, where to start...

I feel a bit sad that while quite a few people have been upset with my putting up the info, I don't think too many actually took the time to check out the links, or the idea that there might be a spiritual down side to yoga/meditation.  I have said I'll do a better job soon, and put up more info and links, but of course, that only really means something if you are willing to look past me and at the sources themselves.

I'm going to speculate here, because I don't have much to go on, but I am guessing one of the reasons that people seem to feel I've somehow done something unfair in being wary and critical of yoga/meditation is that for them, it is indeed a religious sort of thing.  Or if you prefer, spiritual.  I understand that if you perceive that someone is attacking your spiritual practices, you will be upset.

This sort of was part of my point, though.  I am questioning whether or not yoga/meditation can be purely considered on a physical level, something practiced for physical gain alone.  If I had questioned whether drinking 8 glasses of water a day were good for you or not, and put up links to things that question that, I don't think I would have gotten as much protest.  In fact, several people put up religious comparisons for me.  How would I feel if other people said my religious beliefs were dangerous, and etc.  In using this as a comparison, I think you are saying that yoga/meditation IS a spiritual/religious practice.   Because generally people are not quite as emotionally invested in defending jogging, for instance.  (unless you are really hard core.  Then, maybe.  ;)  )

Here is something I'd like to take this opportunity to say.  I have been in the place where someone questioned whether something "spiritual" I was involved in was good or not.  I understand that is not a comfortable place to be.  My own initial reaction was a bit of indignation.  I was upset that anyone would question something that had helped me.  I felt that the other person was judgemental.

And now I see that I was wrong...  ouch for me.  Point is, I understand those emotions.  I empathize.  It is not easy hearing something held important and well loved critiqued.  I get that. 

I will say, though, that if you do feel that way, then be honest with yourself (if you are not already so) that yoga/meditation is more than physical, that it is a highly valued spiritual practice.

And here is something else important that I need to say.  I am worried that in all the debate, I become "the enemy."  I am not any one's enemy, I assure you.  And this is why it is important to me that you understand that if you have been critical of me, or called me ignorant or whatever, I do not hold it against you in any way.  I truly believe that some people who do yoga/meditate may find themselves in a spiritual situation they did not want and can not get out of.

I would be deeply distressed if this happened, but because I had an adversarial attitude, or there were bad feelings, that person would be leery of contacting me.  I know some of you might scoff at this, at least right now, and that is OK.  I just want you to know that I understand what it is like to be convinced of something and find out later you are mistaken.  I will not hold anything you have said to me against you.  If at some point someone who reads this is in a spiritual situation that is distressing you, I promise you I will be here for you.  I know someone who can help you, and you have my absolute word of honor I will believe you, I will not say I told you so, and I will be here to talk too.

Now, last of all, a bit of housecleaning.  If Mr. E.P. is actually here reading this, I did not post your comment.  For two reasons.  Numero Uno is that while I said "have some fun" with making up an alias, I was sort of expecting a bit less of  Bart Simpson and a bit more of the sort of humour that everyone is OK with.  Personally, I can say the word "Penis" but it does seem somewhat juvenile to have to use sexual parts as a nickname, and some people find it offensive.  I just don't find it that funny, particularly as I wonder if it was used exactly because you felt the person you were commenting to would be offended by it.

Number two is this.  I have a double standard.  I will tolerate quite a bit of mocking of myself.  I will totally allow people say I appear ignorant, to call me narrow-minded, or to otherwise stray as close as possible into insult without actually crossing the big line. But I won't allow it to happen to anyone else who comments here, whether it be someone who is agreeing or disagreeing with me.  There are lots of nice ways to make a point.  Use them.  I want people to feel free to be open and honest, without worrying that their comments will be mocked.  Say your point without trying to make someone else feel stupid.  And if anyone feels I have done this to them, please let me know so I can apologize.



I think I did it justice there, right?  That was your point?  It is a point worth discussing and answering.  And I will do more discussing of it later on.  Now it is late, and I am tired.  And E.P.... no hard feelings.  :)  I appreciate your point, but I didn't feel it was presented very kindly.  I have high standards for how others are treated on this blog.  I'm sure if you come back here for more discussion, you will aim your mocking at me.  :)  

Saturday, April 7, 2012

About my blog on Yoga & Meditation

Well, one thing for sure, my last post actually engendered some comments.  I must admit my surprise on this one.  I honestly didn't think m(any) people actually read this blog.  I am not not as surprised that not one single response in any way agreed with anything that I said.

In fact, one person has accused me of being disingenuous.  It's not really an accusation of outright deception, but they are basically saying I have not been sincere or candid...

Which I think is fair for them to say.  I'm not saying that I was doing anything but trying for sincerity and candor, but of course, how should they know that, if they feel my information is misleading?  They don't know me, and so it makes sense, in a way, to assume that instead of being guilty of shoddy blogmanship, I am guilty of non-candor.  So I have been thinking about that, weighing it up in my own mind, have I presented information in a way that is misleading?  Maybe what matters is that people do seem to have all sorts of questions and complaints about what I have written.  (or as in the case of my personal friends, gentle disagreement.)

What I have realized is that I was going about this in too rushed and haphazard a manner.  Here in one post I have started a topic which really could (and has) filled  books.  I think that it was unfair of me to do that.  I stand by my info, but I realize I better do some "splaining."  Right Lucy?  (Sorry, just dating myself.)

For instance: I was NOT trying to assert that each and every person who does yoga & meditation will absolutely have a problem like the ones I mentioned.  I apologize if anyone got that impression.  This is what happens if you rush a topic when you write about it.  (but I HAVE spent some time reading about it, and looking stuff up.  I think I need to also do some more.)  So I am aware that 50,000 people could write in here and say "Hey, I do yoga and that never happened to me."

And judging by the last comment I got, I obviously need to do some explaining about the total and complete difference between the two definitions of meditating.  My good ole dictionary says "meditate" means "engage in contemplation" and in particular, religious contemplation.  I was NOT referring to that sort of meditating in connection with yoga.  I was referring to the increasingly popular definition, which means entering an alpha brain wave state.  This is scientifically verifiable.  If you connect someone who is meditating in this sense to an EEG, you will see a recognizable alpha wave pattern. 

Well, I wouldn't, of course.  I mean someone who can read an EEG.  Though I did see a video of it once, and I really could see the brain wave pattern totally dying down...  You may have heard of this under the more common heading of "biofeedback" but again, NOT ALL biofeedback is measuring alpha waves.  Sometimes it is measuring heart rate,  blood pressure, etc.

Anyway, here is the place where I am most firmly convinced.  I think that what is likely the most dangerous practice, and what I personally am most concerned about, is people practicing this form of meditation.  I could, if I were smart enough and had that sort of time, write a book about the topic.  It is a HUGE topic.  So please, readers, do not put me in the stocks here, but bear with me just a little.  I concede a need to better explain myself, to give you more documentation, and be more methodical.  Give me some time, though, OK, and bear with the fact that it means I can't write the whole thing all at once.  I'll take it in steps this time.

I put yoga and meditation together in my first blog, because that is often the way I find em.  And the information I have found about "spiritual emergence" or "spiritual emergencies" also list yoga, and only yoga.  There is no explanation of what kind of yoga, whether the yoga included meditation or not, etc.   It is listed as an unintentional way of awakening kundalini or awakening awareness, as some prefer to call it.  Since it is listed as being unintentional, it would seem to me that saying "only kundalini yoga will awaken kundalini" would be... well, not accurate to the info, right?  (and yes, hatha yoga IS listed as a kundalini yoga, though I know it is also largely practiced as only being exercise, here in the "west".  This is one reason why it is just really hard to say any specific yoga is THE kind.)

So, there are some things I will further write about.  I might not get to this right away.  I mean, I might blog about some other stuff, while I research more.  For one thing, I AM going to get my hands on Del Pe's book and read it.  I am also going to think about getting my hands on Stanislav Grof's book.  I will blog about other stuff, then I will put up my next blog about yoga/meditation, then blog about other stuff, then put up yoga/meditation stuff.  Because while I would like to do a better job of this, and while I think that at least the discussion is good, (even if people think I am nutso, or even worse, disingenuous) I do have other things I think about and want to discuss.  This isn't primarily a yoga/meditation blog.  I don't want to make it that.  But I do want to treat the topic fairly.

And about poor Swami-J.  I think his point was that yoga is religious.   I don't think I read him wrong on that.  I think he actually seems to me to be a bit offended that people call yoga "just exercise."  In fact, I believe he wrote that (this is a paraphrase) calling yoga an exercise program is like calling Christian baptism taking a shower or having a bath.  His argument is that either you are exercising or you are doing yoga, don't attach the word yoga to what is merely an exercise program.  The word "yoga" is in itself a word with a religious derivation.  I'm sorry my quote of him was misleading to you... I think in just putting yoga & meditation together in my blog, I was skipping a coupla steps of thinking, which was careless.  I need to explain how I would connect yoga to a spiritual practice... in detail.  :) 

I confess that while I disagree with him on every spiritual belief he has, I empathize with him.  If a group of atheist showed up at my church one day touting the health benefits of the Lord's Table, even though they didn't believe in God, or the resurrection, well, let's just say I'd have a hard time moving over for them and saying, "OK, join in!"  Whether or not he is the only yogi to feel this way remains to be seen.  That I respect his opinion about it, that I can say now.

But yes, that is HIS opinion (and mine).  I acknowledge that some Christians would be so excited to see atheists in church, they'd see nothing wrong with it and say "Hey, join in!"  And I will absolutely concede that some yogi's would welcome any and all beliefs to join in yoga, and suggest they'd have much the same motivation as those hypothetical Christians, which would be that half the battle was done in getting more people on board with the faith.  (and yes, that is my opinion, you are free to disagree)

I do think you would have a pretty hard time finding a majority of yogi's who would say that the main purpose of yoga is exercise.  But more on that later.  Feel free, though, if you can actually find some, to let me know who they are.  I sincerely would like to know, and so that I am being totally candid, go back and check your info.  ;)

Here is what I see I need to break down and discuss as individual topics: is yoga a system of exercise, a spiritual practice, or both?  What do the guru's really say about yoga?  What is alpha brain wave meditation?  Is it connected to yoga?  What is a spiritual emergence/emergency?  What about Christian yoga?  Can you keep your own religious perspective and still practice yoga?  Is there a trend in yoga growth, and what is it?

Now I hope I am not still going to fast.  It is hard with a topic this vast, and one where I know everything I write will be highly controversial.  Highly controversial.  If you have never been the dissenting voice in a large group of enthusiastic proponents, I recommend it heartily. (ha ha ha ha...ah)   So again, I ask your patience.  Write me comments.  Be (nicely) critical.  I do have one request, though.  My name is Karen.  You may call me by name.  And if you must comment anonymously (as I acknowledge some of you can't comment otherwise due to not having an account) could I ask that you sign it with a first name, either real or fake?  I don't care which, but it's not much fun responding to "Dear anonymous...." ya know?  Alias's are totally fine.  Have some fun with it.  But don't make me call you "anonymous," mmmkay?

Thursday, April 5, 2012

Yoga & Meditation

If you are a friend of mine named Heather, you might be very annoyed by this post.  Why?  Because this post is titled "Yoga & Meditation" and I'm going to start off with talking about an admission about myself.  Instead of getting straight the point.  Heather, if you actually happen to be reading this, I'm sorry.  :)

Thing is, I struggle with discouragement.  Discouragement, as a concept, isn't usually seen as being the opposite of courage, but I think the two are closely related.  Here is what discourages me:  feeling/thinking/believing that what I do might cost me something and still be futile.  It is the fear of the futility of it that de-motivates me, that makes me sit on my heels and say "Why bother?  What difference will it make anyway?"

And what is it about courage?  Is it a lack of fear?  No.  Courage is when you look at the possible cost of a course of action, and you say "This action is the right one, it is worth it no matter what the cost, so I will do it."  The greater the possible cost, the greater the courage.  And it is a lot easier to be courageous, the more the chance of your action doing some good.  What is more challenging is when you know that the action, in and of itself, is good and worthy, even if it costs you a lot and changes nothing.

It is for me, anyway.  So when I sit to write this blog, and many others, I find myself dis-couraged.  I find myself struggling with believing what I write will make any difference, and feeling like it might cost something I value.  Something I at times value too much.  Which is the respect and good opinion of other people.

And so, I have taken more time then I should have to write this post.  It wasn't only that, I also have had a lot of stuff "going down" in my life, but this lack of courage, this discouragement, was surely part of it.

For Heather's sake, and maybe yours too, I'll just get down to the business of it.  I'm taking a risk here, because I know this is worth doing, and I am going to hope that you might at least consider what I am going to say, though I know it will be pretty unpopular for some of you.

I am worried about the exponential growth of the yoga/meditation movement.  I'm putting the two together, even though I know there are lots of people out there who would protest that the yoga they do is without any spiritual stuff in there.  Increasingly, meditation IS a part of yoga, which is not too surprising considering that yoga was originally (and for many people, like yogi's, never stopped being) a spiritual practice.

Yes, part of my concern is because of my own faith background.  For sure.  I realize that this background will tempt some people to write off what I say as coming out of that background and being therefore invalid.  Please don't do that, yet.  I am prepared to offer you some thought provoking (I hope) material from yoga and meditation proponents.  Sources that encourage meditation and yoga and believe it is beneficial.  But they are being honest, and warning people of the possible dangers.  For this honesty, I am grateful.  Not everyone is honest...

I did some research on the topic, because I am worried about it.  People I know and love, some of them dearly, are practicing this stuff.  You may think I'm just a religious nutso, but I hope you will understand I'm writing this out of genuine concern.  And there is only so much time I have for research, so consider this an invitation to do your OWN research.  I couldn't do it as much, or as exhaustively as I would like. 

But then I thought, "Why should I do your work for you?"  I just want to make you think and truly look into it.  If you really are open and fair and practicing this stuff, then you should be the one to "do your homework on it," so to speak.

So, if you'd like to know where I started finding information, go to the search engine on your computer and type in "spiritual emergency."  That is a good starting place, there are other names you can find this stuff under, like "psycho spiritual crises" but you can figure that out yourself.  If you have access to it at your local library (mine didn't carry it, because I wanted to read it for myself, I checked), there is book written by Del Pe called "The Hidden Dangers of Yoga and Meditation: How to Play with Your Sacred Fires Safely."  I haven't managed to obtain a copy of the book, but I have read some of the reviews of it on Amazon.  I will state (as if I need to, right?) that since Del Pe is a PROPONENT of yoga and mediation, I DISAGREE with him on that part of it which is positive.  I hope that since he IS a proponent, and he (apparently) has some pretty strong warnings about the practices, it will at least motivate you to research for yourself and think about it.

I hope that I have at least piqued your interest.  What is a hidden danger of yoga and meditation?  Well, here is a quote from a yogi, and I hope I have the right site attributed to it.  "All Yoga is Kundalini yoga,"  and then  "...all of yoga actually leads to the activation of Kunadini..."  If I didn't mix it up, then you can find this guy at www.swamij.com  and again, let me say that I in NO WAY endorse this man's teachings or beliefs.  I'm just tell ya what a yogi says about yoga. 

And it is this awakening of Kundalini power which makes yoga (and meditation) dangerous.  I'm not saying this.  (well, I am, but I'd use different language and explanations)  This is coming from proponents of yoga and meditation.  Here are some of the symptoms of Kunalini awakening: nausea, diarrhea or constipation, rigidity or limpness, animal-like movements and sounds, sensations of heat, tremors, involuntary laughing or crying, talking in tongues."  You can find this list at http://www.spiritualcompetency.com/blackboard/lesson/types/kundalinitype.htm

I know some of you are saying "Hey, look, I do yoga/mediation only for the physical benefits, there is nothing spiritual for me with this stuff."   You would be exactly the person I'm talking to.  No point in my writing this to people who are actually LOOKING for a spiritual experience, because they are likely to be quite open to arousing their Kundalini, no?  Here is what I have found in my research, and I'm guessing that is why Del Pe says "HIDDEN DANGERS," the same site says this: Kundalini arousal most commonly occurs as an unintentional side-effect of yoga, meditation, chi kung or other intensive spiritual, particularly meditative, practices.  (emphasis mine)

Yes, I am warning you, so I'm going to be as scary as possible, because I'm afraid you won't listen.... will you listen?  and investigate this?  Please?  Here are some more possible symptoms: hallucinations, seizures, pain, panic attacks, mania, severe depression.  http://www.realization.org/page/doc0/doc0026.htm
If you research more you may also find things like out of body experiences, psycotic breaks, feeling of unreality, not knowing where one's physical body begins and ends...etc.

There is a blog, detailing the personal story of a person who underwent one such "spiritual emergency."  Here it is: http://spiritualemergency.blogspot.com  Every time I put up one of this links, I wonder, should I even do this?  Because so far all of this sources are PRO yoga and meditation, and I'm worried that they will provide a false sense of safety, because many of them claim that you can get help to work through your spiritual emergency and you will gain a great reward reaching a higher spiritual level, a greater spiritual sensitivity.  I personally mistrust this... how can they guarantee any such outcome? 

But if you really are OK with experiencing an unsought arousal of Kundalini, even if it means you might "pay" for it with a psychotic break, in the interests of greater spiritual sensitivity, then really, what can I say to dissuade you...?  What I must do, for the sake of honesty and out of caring, is to let you know that this stuff comes with a risk.  This stuff was designed as a spiritual practice, and we of "western" mind-set are guilty of a great hubris in borrowing spiritual practices and secularizing them.  They are not.  If yoga were truly ONLY a way to stretch and get a stronger body, it would be called stretches, weight training, and a work out routine.  It is called yoga, because it is a practice to "yoke" with the divine.

See, here is where I think, "Have I said to much?"  I know, I sound really extreme... or do I?  Research for yourself.  I just wish so much that if your only goal is physical fitness, you would reconsider going with a program without potential spiritual ramifications.  Really, why not kick-boxing?  Pilate's?

And I do meditate, for the record.  But I don't put my mind in an alpha-wave state (which is the goal of eastern meditation).  I meditate by thinking about God, and talking to Him.  By spending time with Him, I grow in my trust of Him.  I find that "You will keep him in perfect peace, whose mind is set on You, because he trusts in You." (Isaiah 26:3) That is how I find peace in my day, this is how I lower my stress...  But of course, this is a spiritual practice too.  One that I do heartily endorse.  :)

I welcome respectful comments about this.  I welcome being able to talk about this with you further, even if you really disagree.